Voices of Fostering

Meshak - Inside the National Fostering Group Book Club

• National Fostering Group • Season 4 • Episode 13

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In this episode of the Voices of Fostering Podcast, host Tim is joined by Meshak, a trainer at the National Fostering Group. Meshak discusses his multifaceted role, which includes developing and delivering training for foster carers and colleagues, with a key focus on empowerment and mental health. 

The conversation covers the innovative and supportive methods used to train foster carers, including breakout sessions, case studies, and discussions. Meshak also introduces  National Fostering Group’s Book Club, explaining how it started, its growth, and its impact on personal and professional development. The book club serves as a supportive network where foster carers and professionals can share perspectives, learn from each other, and apply new knowledge in their roles. 

Meshak emphasises the importance of understanding various topics such as autism and attachment theories to improve the fostering experience. The episode concludes with an encouragement for listeners to join and participate in the book club to further their learning and support network.

If you would like to find out more about fostering please visit our website here.

If you have any questions that you would like to be answered on our next episode email podcast@nfa.co.uk

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Tim:

So welcome to the Voices of Fostering Podcast. My name's Tim. Today we are joined by Meshak, who is a trainer for the National Fostering Group. Could you just tell us, Meshak a little bit about your role within the organization, be talk before we talk about your book club.

Meshak:

Yeah. So, uh, I'm part of the training team. Uh, so we roll out training for our foster carers, for our colleagues. Where do I start with my role? Actually, it's so multifaceted. Um, some of it's training, some of it's developing new content. Some of it is spent, you know, spent. I spend an hour in what we call the ideas factory with my, uh, with my colleagues coming up with new and innovative ways to, you know, get training across or come up with new ideas. Uh, sometimes they're. Amazing ideas. Sometimes not so much, but yeah. Um, what, um, and yeah, just, just a variety of things, but predominantly, you know, upskilling training, uh, our colleagues, training our foster carers, empowering our foster carers to support their young people ultimately is what we do. You know, so, you know, our young people can have a, you know, have a foster carers who can support them. So, yeah, pretty much.

Tim:

And how do you do that? Will you speak about empowering the carers? How do you do that? Yeah,

Meshak:

so through training, through discussions, through, we do like breakout sessions, we do case studies, we have, uh, discussions as I've already mentioned. Um, I just support 'em. So for example, therapeutic parenting is one of our key, uh, kind of training modules. So we kind of guide them through the training modules. So they get to learn things from, uh, you know, like safeguarding. All the way too, if you want to get really geeky. We talk about the brain science and what's actually going on inside the brain when we talk about trauma, when we talk about A DHD or we talk about mental health and wellbeing.

Tim:

Yeah.

Meshak:

So there's a number of things. There's a support, there's a learning element that's in there, but there's also a supportive element in there as well. Yeah. So, as I said, like we, we've been rolling that mental health training, first aid, uh, mental, mental health, um, wellbeing, just to, you know, uh, you know, uh. Promote our foster carers and all of us actually looking after ourselves in our role. So yeah, there's, there's so many aspects to my job, but yeah. But ultimately it's about learning. It's about, it's about and and empowering them to take the knowledge and put it into practice.

Tim:

Yeah. Sounds really, it sounds like you said multifaceted, but kind of creative aspects to it, and then an overarching. Mental health, uh, umbrella as well, I guess, which is very important for Yeah, absolutely. For everybody. Um, right. We wanted to talk to you about your book club, the, uh, oh yeah. National Fostering Group Book Club. Now, you're currently running this with foster carers. Can you just tell us where the idea came from? Was it you, was it someone else who threw it at you? And just tell us a bit about how it's grown, because it sounds like it definitely has grown.

Meshak:

Oh yeah, so, so the initial idea came from just being on training, and usually you get some foster carers who are really proactive about sharing their learning. They'll be like, oh, I read this book, or I watched this documentary, which links into what we're talking about. So I suddenly got the idea as, oh, it's not just me who's. So-called boring book reader, as my son would call me. We're not boring at all. We're, uh, we're behind the insane people, but, um, but I realized there are other people out there that, you know, you know, really get a lot from learning about, you know, from learning from books. And then, you know, using books as a, as a way to empower ourselves to, you know, be better at our roles, be better at our jobs. So initially the, so initially it was like me and probably two foster carers, and then I kind of shared the idea that it came this bigger thing that, that where, and I thought actually, I'm sure if there's, if there's two or three of us, so dare say, there's more readers around the book, around the organization who wanna get involved. So we started to explore the idea and put the feelers out and yeah, there was a good number of people who, who, who wanted to get involved. So yeah. And, and then it grew to include the, um, the clinical team. So the clinical team are involved. So they, they, uh, they come along and they, and they're involved in the whole process. Um, and yeah, and just, yeah, just spreading the word. And more and more people are joining all the time. So as we just, I go through a phase of the spreading more awareness now, getting more people involved. 'cause the more the merrier, the more perspectives, the more people that could share their own quality view on the books. Add to the book club, give feedback on the book club. That's what's gonna help it grow and develop and become something that's gonna offer more value for all of us.

Tim:

Yeah, and it goes back to empowerment, I guess, like you said at the beginning, you're empowering yourself and each other and with the knowledge from the books. Um, but why do you think, why is it, why are these stories and books that you share within the club, um, why? How do they and why are they so powerful between you? How do you share that information between you?

Meshak:

Well, I think the power is in the people. What I mean by that is the more people we have in the book club, we've got more perspectives. 'cause that's the power of books.

Tim:

Yeah.

Meshak:

I can read it and I'll look at it one way. Somebody else will read it and they'll take something else from it. Another person will read it and they'll extrapolate something additional from it. So, and you know, on our last book club that we did, that's exactly what happened. Um, where again, we had loads of people with different perspectives and I went away from that thinking, actually I've learn something. I, I've read the book, but. Did I really read the book? Yeah. Or actually I've been able to, I'm grateful I was able to lean on somebody else's perspective.

Tim:

Yeah.

Meshak:

To empower myself to say, actually, you know what? What they said about the book was really, really quite interesting. I never looked at it that way. What was the book? What was the Someone on the

Tim:

lines. What's the name of the book? Yeah, what was the book where you both had different opinions on there?

Meshak:

Oh, so it's a book called They Eff You. Right. Okay. Interesting book title. I know, I know. But it, it talks about, uh, parenting and, you know, how early childhood experiences go are affected by different types of parenting styles. Um, uh, it's got a little bit of controversy in there, but that's all good because it gets the conversation going and it definitely got the conversation going during the last book club. Um, so, uh, so yeah, and again, it just developed different perspectives and it was, it was an interesting read. For me at least, it was, it wasn't everyone's different, you know, for some people it was more of a difficult read for other people that really enjoyed it. Some other people took something useful away from it. So whether you enjoy it or not, as you take something useful away from it, that's again another key aim of the book club.

Tim:

Yeah, and I guess if we focus that in a little bit on the world of fostering and the National Fostering Group as well, how do you guys choose the books? What kind of themes and topics do you kind of explore through through the books? Oh,

Meshak:

well, the idea is to explore as many topics as possible, whether it's autism, whether it's talking about attachment theories. Whether it's about, um, just anything that links into, you know, therapeutic parenting, anything that can help us to, but ultimately as foster carers and as colleagues playing a supportive role. You know, even myself as a lowly trainer, it's all about that empowerment, and I'll keep coming back to that word, but it's about enabling them to build relationships. And I would say that one of the fundamental aspects of being able to build a relationship is understanding. So when we understand a little bit more about autism, we, when we understand a little bit more about, um, attachment theories, you know, uh, when we understand more about how early childhood experiences. Can aid us in, in our developments or be detrimental in our developments. It helps us to understand our young people coming into the organization and, and, and into their families, I should say. You know, and, and it's, again, we can take these learnings and put them into practice. I'm not a foster carer myself, but I'm a dad and I've taken some of these things that I've learned from the book club and put them into my own parenting. And ma you know, reading that last book that I mentioned, it really made me reflect as a parent. Yeah. You sitting there, I, I'll be, I'll be sitting at my son's basketball matches 'cause he pays basketball and I'll be on the sidelines. I'll be, I've got certain amount of time to read a book, you see? So I've gotta stick as much opportunity as possible. But I'll read it. I be like, oh my goodness. That's me that they're talking about in this book. Yeah. And it can really make it reflect, you know, but then you can put that reflection into practice and try new things and try different things. And looking after a teenager, if anyone's looked after teenagers before, you know, every teenager is different of course. But absolutely, just being able to step in into that world and understand it a little bit, you know, that book, you know, massively helped me with that one there. So

Tim:

yeah, as parents and I think as foster carers, having those qualities to be able to show. Ah, I think it boils down to being able to listen and show a bit of empathy. And I think you're halfway there, aren't you? And if you can do those things genuinely, then you've got Absolutely. You've got a deep relationship there.

Meshak:

Yeah, absolutely. I see it as, you know, in times I've been able to step into our young people's world, like, uh, on the weekend I've got involved in a bit of a anime, like I'm not a massive anime person, but he watches these anime cartoons and I said, you know what, let me sit down with him and see what it's all about. And it's amazing how much. You can develop your relationship just by stepping into the world. So again, just something I took from the book was, you know, just finding different ways in which you can connect. Yeah. You know, and, and, and how it can foster that relationship, but it be you a carer, be you a parent.

Tim:

I just wanted to talk to you a little bit more about that development actually, because I wanted to know what, what role does the book club play within. The personal development of the people involved with it, with the carers, the professionals, and I guess ultimately the children that are involved in this as well, that we care for, like, so how does the book club play that kind of development role?

Meshak:

Absolutely. So it's a, it's a, it's a, I suppose it's outside of the normal training that we do. It's a new. Different way, a bit more of a relaxed way of learning for those that want to be proactive about their learning. Because I see fostering as a, as a real learning experience, there's always something new to learn. Um, and just the age of development. So again, you know, and I'll keep bleeding on about this word, but you know, when we can empower ourselves with a bit of knowledge. Then it gives us the opportunities to put it into practice. And there's many foster carers out there. I'll go on training sessions and they're like, oh, Shak, we've got this great resource that relates to what we're talking about. Yeah. Or, I learned this thing, or, or actually some of them have got previous professions, which really, you know, gives real insight into the care for young people or experience that they had. So again, it's just another space where they can come to the book club. And it's whether they're a reader or not. You don't, I, I want this, I, I've designed it so you don't necessarily have to be a massive reader. Even if you want to come along and just kind of get involved in the conversation, that that works as well. Yeah. And we're also exploring the idea, uh, to cater to, to, um, to non-readers of looking at documentaries. 'cause everyone likes a doc team. Do you like a documentary? Yeah,

Tim:

I love a documentary. Have to tell

Meshak:

this. I could tell there's a look in your eye, like a bit, a bit, a bit of a bit of a Channel four documentary or somewhere on YouTube or what have you, you know? But again, you know, loads of people will watch like a documentary. So again, be there's opportunities. We could talk about books or documentaries which relate to some of the things that are affecting young people. So for example, the adolescence show that came on on Netflix. Yeah. Yeah, so again, it's, again, it's a bit like the book club with books. It's good to hear different people's perspectives, and again, we all walk away from that, uh, conversation with something new. So we've, we've all learned something new.

Tim:

That leads me onto my next question very nicely actually, because I was gonna talk to you. Um, has there been a particular book or discussion within the book club which you've found massively inspiring or that you've seen inspire a whole group of people or something that's just really changed the perspectives because I've just finished. James clear's Atomic Habits. Oh, okay. Yeah. Which is amazing. It's just about making small changes in your life and they amount to absolutely massive, massive changes overall, long term. Anything like that? Come on, inspire Shak.

Meshak:

Yeah, so I've just, I've just, I've just read, I've been, I'm currently reading a book called Black Box Thinking Uhhuh. It's a book I've had for a number of years. 'cause what happens is sometimes I buy a load of books, then I don't get ran to reading them. Yeah. But I pulled it out from the collection the other day and it basically talks about, you know, um, it's, it's called Black Box Thinking because it talks about airplane, the, the airplane industry and how it utilizes it, it learns from its mistakes.

Tim:

Yeah.

Meshak:

You know, it's, it's an industry which is all about learning from its mistakes. Yeah. Every near miss. Every error, every, you know, accident that ever happens, there's openness and transparency, and they use the information to keep the airplanes in the sky, to keep people safe. Yeah. Not everywhere's like that, but it, uh, but it talks about how, you know, um, just how, even for ourselves and so in personal developments, that mistakes are part of that personal development and, you know, and how, you know, a trial and error basically. Is where, you know, is what inspires people and which drives people forward in their careers. It's that learning opportunity. Yeah. Yeah. It's when you don't wanna learn from mistakes that. Things get repeated. Yeah. I just find it really interesting how it uses different scenarios. It uses different case studies. It uses different industries. It compares different industries in terms of how they use trial and error or don't use trial and error or use or, or learn from their mistakes. And then applies it to a personal perspective about how we can use it to develop ourselves as well. So yeah, I find it really interesting. Really, really interesting

Tim:

personal development, man. That's what it's all about. Oh, absolutely. So I just wanted to end with the National Fostering Group. Obviously big organization. The book club is one example of the kind of day-to-day get togethers that you have for foster carers, but what is it? You are finding people who you work with and the foster carers are coming to the book club for.

Meshak:

I think they're coming together just to be with other foster carers and because it's, I see it as another type of support network. Mm. You know, where people can come together and, you know, it is, they can talk about the books so they can also talk about their own experiences. You know, it's, it is such a powerful thing when they hear someone say, oh, it's not just me who this is happening to, or it's not just me who's experiencing this. It creates a bit of a collective and then you can start to reflective other people. I think people are coming along to learn from other people. Um, I think some people are coming along, to be honest. So the last one, oh my goodness. It was beautiful. There was a, you know, someone had a very strong view Yeah. About the book, and that's fine. That's, that was the idea of the book. They had a very strong view, you know, uh, and uh, and in contrast to somebody else's view. But there was a bit of a middle. The, the conversation was, was, was respectful, but there was, it was lots to, there's lots to extrapolate from that conversation. Yeah. Watching, you know, both of those dynamics, both polarities talking about this book, you know, and yeah, it looked, it looked like a bit of a dingdong, but it wasn't, it was, it was what we call a dialectic. It was actually, oh, this is what I think, this is what I, this is what I think, and this is what I don't think, and this is some evidence. And, and actually from that discussion and observing that, absolutely I took a load of learnings away and, and things that I didn't really think about before. So it is perfectly fine to have different opinions. Yeah. But do you know what? We learn something and we always walk away from it, shake it hands at the end of it. And that's the idea.

Tim:

Yeah.

Meshak:

You know, and we've learned something new until we can take away and put into practice afterwards if we want to. And it's a space for people to share their own books as well. So, uh, at, at this moment in time, the clinical team play a key role in, they will kind of select the book that we read, but that's gonna be opened up soon so that, um, uh, foster carers can put forward their own recommendations as well. So as long as it's, as it's in line with some of our therapeutic parenting principles. It gives us some learning or relates to some of the training that we already do, then absolutely. So we do like a vote and then they can kind of bring their own books in as well. So it's a bit of a democracy. Yeah, that's the idea. So whether you're a reader, you're a non-reader, whether you're like watching documentaries, whether you read books or not, it's a collective space where people can come together and that's the ultimate aim where we can come together, we can learn, we can take something from it.

Tim:

Shak, it's a fantastic idea and thanks for coming on and telling us about it. I hope it continues to grow and inspire. Yeah, I wanna be part of it.

Meshak:

There's always a space for you. Anybody else, even producer in the background, anyone who wants to come along and join. Uh, all they need to do is go onto our learning platform, search the book club, and you'll see all the information there, uh, in terms of the dates when you can join and get involved. So we're we, we, we, we, we, we've kick started a new book now, so there's still plenty of time for anyone that wants to get involved. Sorry, Tim. I was always gonna do some shameless. A hundred percent percent. It's gonna be done for anyone that wants to get involved. Absolutely. You know who's within the organization then? Absolutely. Um, just, uh, you can find out all the information on our internal platforms.

Tim:

Pleasure talking to you today. Thank you so much for coming on.

Meshak:

My pleasure. Thank you. Having me along. Thank you.

Helen:

Thank you so much for joining us for another episode of Voices of Fostering. If you'd like to find out more, head online and search National Fostering group and make this the year you foster.