Our special episode with Ashley John-Baptiste

In this episode of Voices of Fostering, we sit down with Ashley John-Baptiste–a Cambridge graduate and BBC presenter–to discuss his extraordinary journey from foster care to academic and professional success.

Ashley shares deeply personal stories of his experiences growing up in various foster homes, the impact of dedicated foster carers like 'Joyce,' and his transition to adulthood. He also explores the resilience he developed and its application to his career and personal life.

Listeners will gain inspiration from Ashley's story and valuable insights into the importance of inclusivity, resilience, and support within the foster care system. Be sure to check out his book 'Looked After,' which sheds light on these crucial experiences.

If you would like to find out more about fostering please visit our website here.

If you have any questions that you would like to be answered on our next episode email podcast@nfa.co.uk

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Chapters

• 0:00 Introduction and Guest Welcome
• 0:17 Ashley's Early Foster Care Experience
• 1:52 Impactful Foster Carers
• 7:30 Advice for Potential Foster Carers
• 9:50 The Power of Resilience
• 15:18 Writing 'Looked After'
• 17:56 Reflecting on Personal Records
• 19:59 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Transcript

0:00

Welcome to the Voices of Fostering podcast. We have a great guest on today. Uh, we welcome Ashley John Baptiste. Ashley, your story from foster care to BBC's presenter and Cambridge graduate is incredible to read. Could you give us a bit of an insight as to what it was like growing up in foster care to begin with? Sure. So I was placed into care at around the age of two. Far too young to remember when actually went into care between ages of two and 18. I was moved about a bit, so I was moved to four different foster homes across Southeast London and I also spent time in residential care, a care home placement, which is very different to living with a foster family. So that's five different placements all before the age of 18. Of course you don't need to be an expert in psychology or anything like that to know that moving about not having consistency in your adult relationships, having a transient of foster carers and professionals is not going to be stabilizing. It's not gonna be good for your self-esteem. So it was, you know, in parts a quite tough childhood, but there was some incredible. Individuals, professionals, foster carers in that really troubled sort of journey, um, who were incredible and made such a positive difference. That's a lot, isn't it, to begin with, like you say, before the age of 18. I wondered if you could, um, you, you've spoken very warmly in the past. I've seen you in interviews and read, uh, parts of your book about, uh, some of the foster carers that you grew up with. I wonder if you could tell us about. A couple of examples where they really made a difference. So I can't remember the first home that I was in because I was just so young, but I do remember really vividly my second foster placement. I had, um, a Caribbean foster mum called Joyce in the book, I called her Joyce. Um, we had to protect. Their real names for a range of reasons. Um, and she was this Caribbean matriarchal figure. I went to live with her when I was about four years old, and she was just the most amazing. Mother and figure, and I thought I'd spend the rest of my childhood with her. That wasn't the case 'cause I moved around a lot. But the time that I spent there was really informative. Um, her children were like my aunties and uncles. She, 'cause she was elderly, she had a grandson who was like a brother. And I think. For all of the movement and turbulence of care in that home, I genuinely felt loved. I genuinely felt like I was part of, of the family, and I think that really is what you want as a looked after child to feel like you are a part of a family. And I felt that with Joyce. Um, she was very inclusive. I didn't feel different. I wasn't treated differently. I think about her food. My God, she was the, she could chop it up. Caribbean cuisine. She had it down to a patch. She was amazing. Jerk. Chicken, macaroni and cheese, rice and peas. And you know, I talk about food when I talk about jokes 'cause that's what home's about, right? It's about those. Those senses and, and those tones of home and her cooking made me feel at home. I have fond memories of Christmases. I can still see her, you know, as a little child, sort of milling around the house, polishing the fur furniture and just being the most safe kind of maternal figure. Um, so it was tough when I had to leave her, but I am, I will always be grateful, uh, for the time that I had with Joyce and, and the last home that I lived in as well. So many sort of positive attributes to that, to that home. I had a foster mom and a foster dad, and prior to, to going to that last home, Tim, um, I struggled a lot at school and I had a string of suspensions and, and being excluded, and that's. That's not, um, remarkable, unfortunately for many looks after children. But in this home there was this kind of transfer where I began to do well at school. And so from being. A kid who wasn't particularly, um, celebrated for his academic potential. I went on to do well and, and that was because of the home and the culture and just speaking positivity over me. Um, they had a daughter who they had raised to really value her education, and I think that was quite inspiring to see. So. Yeah, that last home was really positive as well, and, and certainly made a difference in terms of my educational outcome. I could genuinely see your face light up then when you were talking about Joyce, like it was a real, almost a bit emotive, and I just wondered if you could tell me someone like Joyce or one of the other carers, um, you've experienced, what qualities really make those foster carers special and, and make you do exactly what you just did, like your face light up. Yeah, sure. I mean, you know, I. It's quite hard because you don't, you know, first of all, when you are a child, you, you're not objectively kind of scrutinizing are you the, your parents or your guardians. But looking back, I think inclusivity was a big one with Joyce. Like I felt like I was a part of her family and you know, I do a lot in this space of the care. System now where I've made documentaries about the issue, I meet a whole load of people who work in it who've been looked after, and not everybody feels included in their homes. But Joy certainly made me feel included. She was prepared to make me feel part of the family. Hmm. Um, and, and also, um, she, she, she was just. Really resilient. Like, um, when I say resilient, I mean that, you know, there was a lot for her to deal with. She was elderly. She had to have meetings with social services, with professionals. Often there were moments in life where she had to go above and beyond to support me and that required a real resilience from her as well as, you know, supporting me. She had a grandson and she was a very active grandmother. She was a very active parent to her, to her children. She just showed up for me in the most remarkable way, and I know that from her that took a lot of day-to-day resilience, consistency, and I will forever be grateful to her because of that. Um, and that resilience is what I saw in the last family that I lived with as well. Right. Um, you know, when I got there, I was still getting suspended from school, but they were so patient with me, they were. They believed in my potential, even when I didn't see it in myself, when I didn't know what my capabilities were, they believed that I could do well at school. They believed that I could, you know, um, kind of approach it in a positive way. And that showing up for you, that seeing your potential when you can't see it in yourself is really critical, I believe, when it comes to being a good, a good, a life changing. Foster parent and um, no doubt there'll be many people with those qualities who equally have it within themselves to be good foster parents. What would you say to those people who are listening to this now and thinking, I'd quite like to do it. I'm resilient, I've got the patience. What would you say? What would be your advice? I'd say 100% do it. Do it like, you know, as well as, as well as those inequalities that I think many people naturally have, there are now systems of support, right? And so if there's a particular person considering fostering, they know they have the qualities, but they're still a bit reluctant, hopefully they're reassured in knowing and learning that there are support systems out there to help people who are new to this. Um, and I always say, if you have the capacity to love. A biological child or you know, a relative, you have the capacity to love a foster child. It's, I just believe it's, um, it's a very human thing to love a child, irrespective of whether they're your blood or not. And, um. Those qualities on display, resilience care, inclusivity, everything we've spoken about, those qualities can positively shape the life of a child. And I would say to anyone considering foster care that I don't think there's anything more life affirming than seeing. It's a positive difference that you can make in the life of a young person who's vulnerable, who needs your help. Um, I've had a few occasions where I've been able to go back to people who have helped me mm-hmm. To thank them, to big them up for all that they have done. And it is the most life-affirming thing, not just for me, but for them. To see the positive they impact that they've had on me. And so again, to anyone considering fostering my God, you know, you just dunno how you're gonna help a young person. And then that full circle moment of when they thank you, when they are able to credit you for that positive impact, it's just the best thing ever. Um, I know it from my own lived experience. I mean, you've, you've spoken quite openly, um, about how you've. Used it as a source of strength really being put in, uh, as a fostered when you were younger. It, how, how do you apply that to your day-to-day life? How do you use that as a strength? Wow. Well, you know, I think we, we've said the word resilience a lot, but I think when you are in care and you're navigating moving homes. The realities of leaving care because that's a real thing. Many leave care at 18 or in their early twenties, and you are having to adapt to, to adulthood quickly. You have to be resilient, right? And so the resilience that I had to kind of exercise as a looked after child and someone who left care, it's that same muscle that I use throughout my life now. Be it in my career as a dad,'cause I've got two beautiful little girls in my day-to-day life. Like that resilience of, of showing up when you don't feel like it, dealing with trauma, dealing with challenges. Mm-hmm. But I'm so grateful for that muscle that I've had of resilience that I had to cultivate as a young person because it, it serves me well now and also. In particular with broadcasting. For a long time, I was quite reluctant to talk about my care experience because I found myself in quite middle class privileged broadcast spaces, and I somehow thought that that lived experience would kind of make me different in a negative way. Over time, I began to realize that it's such. A power actually, because it, my lived experience allows me to have empathy with all sorts of people in interviews, in documentary making. Um, and there's relatability that I have with certain communities, you know, because, um, because of what I've been through. So even in my career as a broadcast, I began to see my lived experience as a superpower because of the sensitivities it gave me with other people in other communities. Which of course, as you know, is critical for interviews. It's critical for being able to get people to open up and to trust you and, um, I don't think I would have that ability. In the same way if, um, if not for what I'd been through as a young person. Yeah. And I think people know, um, when you have that lived experience and when you show genuine empathy, and I think that that is very, very apparent in an interview. And in your interviews, you are, you're still very much immersed in this world, Ashley and I wondered if you could tell me, um, or if you've stumbled across any stories recently when you were putting together your book of people that genuinely inspired you from, from this world. I. Of the care system? Well, you know, um, there were so many people, um, that I kind of, when I wrote the book, there was a lot of anxiety actually for a range of reasons. Um, but there was some incredible support. It was Lem say, who is, um, a well-known poet, author care, experienced himself. Um, he was really supportive in, in just kind of. Given a bit of guidance about what it is to write a book that's so personal about a sector as well. Um, Alex Weal, um, the late Alex Weal is an incredible author, um, fiction and a fiction, um, and nonfiction. And I, I've read his work and I remember he also grew up in care. He lived in residential care for part of his childhood. And I remember, um, DM DMing him on x. Back in the day when it was called Twitter, and he was so generous. Um, but, but you know, just, I should also say the response to the book, my God, has been absolutely amazing. Um, it's been out for a year now. Mm-hmm. Of course. It's, the paperback has just come out. But, um, the amount of messages I get even now on a daily basis of, they're just so pertinent and, and so profound, you know. I got one, I got one today from a head teacher who's adopted two girls, and he was a bit just struggling with, you know, the approach of that. And he, he DMed me on Instagram to say that I'm, the book was just, well, the most, the most sort of, let me get it up 'cause I don't wanna butcher the, the explanation. It's the most moving book is read. I'm, I'm looking at my phone now and to know that, to know that, um, the book is having that impact. Even still for people who are navigating some form of care, um, that is just the most special thing to me as an author. How does that make you feel when you sat at home with your kids? It's, it's the best and, you know, um, because nothing is more important than the bond between a caregiver and a child. Be that biological, be that in adoption, be that in fostering or any other form of care. So to know that this book is helping people in those places, in those spaces of care, to know that this book is providing an insight that's providing hope, encouragement, um, it's the best. I had a 17-year-old, um, say that, that they messaged me to say that this is the first time that they felt seen in a book. You can't put a price on that, you can't put, it would be impossible for me to overstate just how meaningful that is to me, because I know what it was like to feel like an isolated, looked after child, and to now know that this book for others is kind of making them feel seen, feel a bit more empowered. My God, I would write the book again and go through the whole process again, knowing. It's having that sort of impact. Let's just talk about the book quickly. It's called Looked After, it's Out Now in paperback. You've spoken a little bit about it there, but I wonder, uh, what made you want to put these stories and these experiences down on paper as opposed to doing stuff like this podcast tv? What, what's the difference there? How, how did that shape up for you? So when you grow up in care, and for anyone who's considering Phos, and this is really useful to know. Um, you have professionals who are writing about your life all the time. So as I was growing up, there were social workers who were kind of documenting moments of my life. Um, teachers would write their records and whatnot and so on. Leaving care, I had just endless records that were written about my life and who I was. And at some point in my sort of early adult years, I remember going through some of my records. And kind of not recognizing the guide that they'd written about this boy that they'd written about my journey. My life was narrated by professionals and actually people that I didn't really know. And this process of writing my book and writing what I remembered. And yeah, there was a bit of corroboration in terms of going back to those files, but me writing this book really was about centering my voice. Yeah. In my narrative and in my journey and being the central voice of, um, of, of, of, of experience. And so really it was kind of reclaiming my power and yeah, giving voice to my own journey. And I think that's the powerful thing about being creative, about writing, about being able to talk about things, especially for looked after, uh, children, care experienced people. Is is that using your voice? It, it kind of centers yourself in your own journey and many, many people still going through care don't always feel that sense of, um, ownership of their own story. So it was a really personal thing with quite a personal kind of, um, missions. But to see the broader impact honestly is, um, quite unexpected. But, but yeah. Lovely to see and. Very powerful to inspire, looked after children who could be reading that. I guess that's maybe quite an emotional thing for you to think about that that could be the case. And also people who are potentially listening to this podcast who want to, or are thinking about becoming carers, um, could also be reading it and feeling inspired as well. Um, so I wanna thank you for that, Ashley. And it's really powerful. You're talking about reading. Own notes from your childhood and feeling a bit detached from that. Can we just end on you? Just, just how, how did, when you did that, how did it feel? How were you in that moment? What were you doing, for instance? How did that whole, how did that all look? I was, so when I left care, I got a council flat. Mm. And I remember I was, I, it was after the union. I was still in that council flat when I read my records. And you can't apply for them. The local authority takes a while to give them to you because often they'll go through your records and the debt, things that might be seen to kind of compromise third party privacy or anything like that. So even when I got the records, I wasn't privy to all my information. Mm-hmm. Because of safeguarding and editorial kind of. Boundaries to that again, so you don't necessarily feel ownership. It was, um, I remember just being really tired. That was, it was less like dense or deep emotion and I was just exhausted from like reading the first like, couple years of, of my journey. I remember, um, words that were negative. Um. Those, they were words used to, to describe me in, at particular junctures of life. And, um, most care experience, people that I've spoken to who have read their files, they will say that their files are not reflective of the essence of who they are. And I think that's true even now. Um, you know, but, but not just, not just for. The young person, but for all the plays involved in the life of a child, mm, there's so much more humanity and richness to all of those interactions that sort of clinical files will never convey. Um, you know, and so again, the book really is my, um, attempt to kind of counter that and put more humanity into what I went through and yeah, hopefully it's, it's, it's, um, it's resonating with care experience, people in particular. Mate, the humanity is there in abundance. Um, it's called Looked After. It's by Ashley John Baptist. We're really grateful for you coming on today. Thank you for being so open and honest. Ashley, absolute pleasure. Thank you. Thank you so much for joining us for another episode of Voices of Fostering. If you'd like to find out more, head online and search National Fostering Group and make this the year you foster.